INTERVIEW: Dami Im on new single 'Paper Dragon' - "In order to find the courage, and the strength and the resilience, you have to first feel the weakness and the fear."

Interview: Jett Tattersall
Dami Im is one of Australia’s most beloved and respected artists and has recently launched the next chapter in her career with the release of new single ‘Paper Dragon’. Originally planned to be her entry for Eurovision 2021, when this year’s contest was cancelled due to the coronavirus pandemic Im decided to release the track now when the world needs something “fun and colourful and happy”. Written remotely with singer-songwriter ELKI and produced by Konstantin Kersting (Tones and I, Mallrat), ‘Paper Dragon’ is an anthemic, synth-inflected pop track with an empowering message of resilience and staying strong: “I'll be staring down at you when you look up into the sky / You thought you pushed me down but I am flying high…I am a dragon, I breathe fire / Don't try to fight, watch and admire.” With throwbacks to the carefree pop of her earlier years in music (such as ‘Alive’ and ‘Super Love’) it is a joyful track which, like all music she has released this year, shows an artist who has never sounded more confident in her art.

The single marks Im’s first release with her new record label, ABC Music, and to celebrate her new music she is performing live shows throughout Queensland in September and October. Her fifth studio album is expected next year and promises to be her most exciting and assured work yet. We recently caught up with Dami to find out more.

Dami! So good to catch up with you again. How are you faring these days?
I'm doing okay, I'm doing okay. Can't complain considering everything.

Let's talk about the beautifully assured pop gem that is ‘Paper Dragon’. Oh, my goodness. Congratulations! Tell me about it.
Oh, thank you. So initially, at the beginning of this year, I announced that I was going to go back to try and do Eurovision again next year and after that announcement, I was getting prepared and writing songs and looking for the right song for that, and I had found this song in a different version. I was going to work on it to use it as my Eurovision song, I thought it was perfect. And since then, Eurovision was cancelled along with everything else. I didn't want to wait two or three years to even consider whether I'm going to do Eurovision or not to release the song. So I just kept working with my co-writer, ELKI, on the song, getting it produced up with Konstantin and I decided to release it as my single. It's big, anthemic pop about telling your doubters who you really are and that you have this fire inside you. A ‘don't mess with me’ kind of song!

I love it. It's also touching on that that fierce fragility that women are particularly requested and are known to have, as well as the softness. Do you think that it's necessary to feel vulnerable before you can feel empowered? Do you think the power comes from the vulnerability?
Absolutely. In order for somebody to find the courage, and the strength and the resilience, you have to first really feel the weakness and feel the fear. You have to acknowledge it, that's really important. For me, I found that once I identify where the fear comes from, and what that insecurity is even about, once I can name it and know what it is and admit that that's what I'm feeling, I'm able to then move on to finding the strength to overcome that. Finding that courage and the power within myself only after knowing that I have the weakness as well.

I totally agree. Again, I think the song lyrically works so beautifully with that, and I love that you've put it into this real gorgeous pop anthem, which is exactly what we need right now.
Yeah, you know, it sounds all very serious and empowering and all of that, which I love, but I also wanted something that was not too serious as well as something that when you listen to it, it's just fun and you don't have to listen too deeply to enjoy it. You can bop along and you don't have to think too much.

Last year you released ‘Crying Underwater’, which was such a poignant about suicide. It was very different.
I've done three singles previous to ‘Paper Dragon’ that were a lot more serious. Slower songs and deep and introspective, which I do enjoy but I think this year I found myself not really looking for those songs to listen to, you know what I mean? I don't need any more sadness at the moment. I just want to feel happy and colourful and things to just cheer me up. I found I'm reaching for those, so, I figured other people might too.

The last time we spoke for the magazine, you spoke about how you were on The X-Factor you were seen as the old woman simply because you were married and how the fans have chosen to do things with your image simply because of the pigeonhole that was created for you. It seems like that happens a lot to talent show winners, but particularly women. They feel boxed into a certain sort of sound or mood. You really wanted to break out of that and do your own thing. When did you start to feel that distancing yourself from that sound and image that was handed to you? When did you feel like that you were pulling away?
Earlier on in my career, I was quite naïve to what was happening and what could happen. And when I was with my last label, the types of music that I was making, and I was told to make wasn't what I wanted. But I thought at the time, ‘well, we just got to do what we got to do’. And you know, I don't want to upset anyone, I just accepted it as something that everybody has to accept because you're with a big label. It's a great opportunity. So at the beginning, I just went with the flow, and I wanted to make people happy, I was bit of a people pleaser. I didn't want to rock the boat too much. Also I didn't have the knowledge or the experience or the support of people around me to tell me that I didn't have to do what they wanted me to do and record music that I didn't really want to record. And then I just thought, if I wait it out, there will come an opportunity where I can really make my decisions again, and have complete control over the music and the creativity. And I realised that at one point that wasn't going to be given to me. There was a specific moment where I was like ‘oh wow, I compromised with my music’ and I realised I'm wasn’t going to be rewarded for keeping the peace. So that's when I thought, okay, I really need to just be unafraid to cause disruption and if that means upsetting a few people that are powerful then so be it. There came a time where I had to make that call even if that meant losing everything. It meant more to me to stick to believing in myself and my vision as an artist than to just keep the peace or keep the relationship.

Now that you've recently signed with ABC Music, do you feel in this pairing you've got a stronger hold on your creative control, while also having a label behind you?
Yeah, absolutely. With the new label, and the ABC, the culture is really beautiful. I can feel that they respect what the artist wants to do and their vision, and where they want to go. I think I'm in a really good place because I have that support around me and people are there to listen to me and I get to have the final say. I do love collaborating and hearing other people's opinions, you know? I don't just like to have the yes people around me all the time. I want people to challenge me and tell me if I'm wrong, or making a stupid decision, but I also need to know that I'm being heard as well and being respected. And I really feel that that's a healthy culture, and at ABC I'm feeling that support and the respect. I feel really optimistic.

I'm listening back to your winning The X-Factor release ‘Alive’ from 2013. You’ve got this heavy production and your voice is a couple of octaves higher. How do you feel that your sound has developed hand in hand with your personal experiences over the past seven years? Can you hear it in your voice?
Yeah, so much change. I'm just constantly learning so much and taking everything in. So much has happened to me and I've gone through a lot throughout those these years after The X-Factor. It does show through my voice and the way I sing, the way I write. I don't like listening to my past songs that much mostly because I'm so sick of it by the time I've, released it and I've done the promo. I'm like, ‘okay, I've listened to that enough times’. So I move on to the next thing. I also feel what I did last year is not what I would do this year. I would go, ‘Oh, why did I do that?’ I used to be a bit embarrassed about that, like, ‘why am I doing and why am I not better?’ But I think it's a really good thing. I now realise that I never want to look back at what I did a year ago and be like, ‘yeah, I'll just keep doing that’. I always want to be improving and evolving and trying new things. I feel really strongly about growth and learning new things. That's something I really believe is really important in my life. I just want to keep growing and evolving.

You always want to be slightly embarrassed about the things you did six months ago. Just a little bit. Yeah, that's a great point. Not too much. Hopefully not ‘burn that thing!’ Not that much!

You have gone through so much in this industry and so much change and so much self-discovery. As you just mentioned you did go through a tempestuous time. Did you ever have a moment that it just didn't feel worth it anymore? That you're like, you know what, I'm just gonna disappear and write quietly for myself.
I feel that quite often, because I have so much ups and downs at times. I can be very hormonal. And I know it now. When I'm feeling super down and low. I'm just like, ‘what am I doing this for?’ And I question ‘Am I doing it right? Do I need to change something?’ But then I think that's only because I'm really hormonal and feeling down. And I'll get over it after a few days. But I also realise I always have had those thoughts, like, forever. So, no matter what job I have, I would question myself, ‘do I not belong here?’ But then, once I get out of that, I realise ‘this is where I'm meant to be, this is what I'm meant to do.’ I was born to write and sing and perform and that's what I love doing. That's what makes me feel alive, it expands me.

But it's good. That’s what we hear in your music, to coin a very millennial phrase, you're living your truth there Dami.
Yeah, I think when you're in those low moments, you can't write those songs. But once you're out of it, you can use it to pour it into a creative outlet.

You are touring ‘Paper Dragon’ in a very COVID safe environment, that is an incredible leap from your amazing online Sunday Sessions, which we've all eaten up. How do you feel about getting in front of an audience for these live shows, particularly after the year we've all had?
Oh, my gosh, it feels amazing and kind of surreal to be on stage again. Also a little bit strange, because people are sitting far away from each other on their tables. It’s a little different to a normal show. But just being able to do this is quite incredible. It feels like we're in another universe being able to have shows here in Queensland. I'm aware that we're so lucky to be in this position and I just love seeing us having a job again, including the people in the industry that do the sound, the lighting, the band, you know? Everybody. They all come to life because they're working and I'm so happy even in a way more than being on stage. The joy that gives me, of course, that's huge, but just looking at the crew around me come to life that gives me so much life. It's been tough for so many people working in this industry. I wish that things will come back sooner.

Lastly, before I let you go, you have released a number of singles this year. Is there an album on the way?
Absolutely. Yes, yes, yes! I've been doing a lot of writing and co-writing on Zoom, which I have quite enjoyed, I didn't know how that would go. So I have some songs that I'm super, super excited to hopefully include on my album. If things go to plan, then I will have an album next year. Yay!

’Paper Dragon’ is out now via ABC Music. You can download and stream here.

Dami Im is touring throughout Queensland in October. For further information and tickets click here

Friday 9 October – Tanks Arts Centre, Cairns 

Sunday 18 October – Solbar, Maroochydore

To keep up with all things Dami Im you can follow her on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter.